There's sizeable demand for people who want to be able to do runs to the bigbox stores for garden and DIY renovation supplies and store it the rest of the time.
Toyota brand Scion is back and it's going to sell a kei truck in America (theautopian.com)
79 pointsby NaOH2 hours ago60 comments
6DM 30 minutes ago
With a built in 25mph limiter, that eliminates "city" driving too unfortunately. Most roads around me are 35 mph.
benfrancom 25 minutes ago
I see folks going 25mph in 35mph every time I drive!
kridsdale1 23 minutes ago
Speed limits are an upper bound.
DoctorOW 20 minutes ago
American here, in practice no. They are generally only the upper bound for dense neighborhood streets, throughout most other roadways you will be considered a poor driver if you go lower than the speed limit.
readthenotes1 18 minutes ago
Where I live the major strode has a 45 mph speed limit and during most times of the day we only get to 35 mph but people make up for it by running the red light
Manuel_D 10 minutes ago
I can ride my ebike at 28 MPH on a street with a 25 MPH speed limit and I'll regularly get cars tailgating me honking and crossing the double line to pass.
bryanlarsen 19 minutes ago
You need to complain to your congressman, not to Toyota. The 25mph limit is set by the Low Speed Vehicle standards.
erickhill 26 minutes ago
660cc engine at ~40 horsepower is about the same as a mid-70s VW Beetle - not in cc size, but HP potential.
This little truck could do a lot more than 25 mph if it were allowed to do so. Not saying that would be safe, and I'd not want to ever put one on a busy freeway, but for getting around most urban cities in the US it's fine as-is but would be even better if the limit was ~40 mph.
Grombobulous 7 minutes ago
For those of you clamoring for kei trucks to be street legal in the US, you really need to do some street view comparisons between Japan and the US.
US roads are built for much, much higher speeds. Kei cars purposefully give up safety with the caveat that they’re only used on low speed roadways, and Japan designs their roads with the intention of these vehicles being acceptably safe in that context.
__alexander 33 minutes ago
It’s a huge mistake to limit the speed to 25mph. When this is released in 2027, Kei trucks will be street legal in Colorado. I would have pre-ordered this without question but that speed makes it useless for basic commuting or running errands.
TSiege 30 minutes ago
I think the strategy is specifically not going for customers who want it for those things. It's meant for farms and work sites not commuting or running errands
bryanlarsen 26 minutes ago
AFAICT, This truck will not be able to pass either the Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards (FMVSS) or the EPA/CARB emissions standards for high speed vehicles. The new Colorado rules for Kei vehicles does not remove those requirements because it relies on the existing exemptions available for 25+ year old vehicles.
IOW, it needs to keep the 25mph speed limiter to qualify as a low speed vehicle, even in Colorado.
mike_d 23 minutes ago
EPA/CARB effectively sets a minimum size for trucks. Rather than having a small light truck that can do the job, you get a Ford F250 hauling a single bale of hay.
But rolling back or adding exemptions for small trucks is political suicide despite the clear environmental benefits.
bryanlarsen 20 minutes ago
The fact that this tiny engine couldn't meet emissions standards is bonkers. But that's the law as written right now.
readthenotes1 16 minutes ago
Where I live the Ford F-250 is not used for falling a single bit of anything other than air. They are in pristine shape and look like they've never been outside the city limits nor off City roads
ceejayoz 9 minutes ago
My favorite example of this is the big lifted pickups innnnnnnching over slightly bumpy railroad crossings.
Grombobulous 12 minutes ago
This isn’t really true. See: Ford Maverick.
CARB only nudges manufacturers, but the market’s own purchase preferences are doing the big push.
Perhaps the biggest nudge is that gasoline is undertaxed. Consumers will never see a reason to stop driving a 18-25mpg truck when gas being less than $5 a gallon is considered a “high” price. The gas tax hasn’t kept up with inflation.
I don’t love the ford F-150 for being a monster truck, but consider this: with the right configuration it sears 6 adults comfortably, plus having a bed for cargo. Families legitimately replace minivans and other family vehicles with it, plus it can tow and haul being the body on frame truck that it is.
__alexander 14 minutes ago
Good point.
lastofthemojito 25 minutes ago
Toyota doesn't seem to be aiming for your business just yet. From their press release:
> As an intentionally low-volume, niche vehicle, the KEI-01 will initially be offered through a fleet-focused pilot program to help the company learn how it can best serve U.S. customers and use cases.
https://pressroom.toyota.com/toyota-says-okei-to-america-int...
I do hope they're able to build on this, and maybe offer left-hand-drive and a more reasonable top speed eventually.
laughing_man 18 minutes ago
I doubt Toyota will ever produce a small, inexpensive pickup that you would actually feel comfortable driving on a freeway. It would cut into its Tacoma and Tundra sales, which have a good profit margin. At least, not without some other manufacturer taking market share with such a vehicle.
SoftTalker 12 minutes ago
Limiter delete will likely be readily available in the aftermarket.
julienb_sea 9 minutes ago
It's RHD. I suspect they are testing the waters before they build a proper LHD model targeting the broader US consumer market.
heohk 12 minutes ago
Mom, Dad, I'm kei
Liuser 44 minutes ago
Who is the target market for this? It’s an ICE vehicle, 4wd and limited to a maximum speed of 25mph. Farmers?
nemomarx 42 minutes ago
You do see people taking tractors on roads between farms pretty often, and they usually have the speed limit stuff on.
jdlshore 39 minutes ago
“This makes it not really usable as a daily driver, but keeps it in this beautiful sweet spot where it has a shocking number of commercial and agricultural uses.”
Liuser 37 minutes ago
Doh thank you. No excuses I can give for my poor reading comprehension.
behringer 39 minutes ago
Farmers or land owners. Great for hauling around your property. Like a 4 wheeler with a trailer but road legal.
everdrive 38 minutes ago
It also seems like it'd be a really good city pickup truck.
kelp6063 37 minutes ago
Farmers and universities have been picking up kei trucks for the last few years for things like groundskeeping work. Being able to sell a brand-new vehicle with parts availability to these customers is what Toyota is trying to capitalize on
alistairSH 33 minutes ago
I have a few friends who've purchased older kei trucks. One for use on his property, the other got his tagged in NC (IIRC, it was NC). The local bicycle shop also has a kei van as their "shop truck" (another used one imported from Japan). The imports will go faster than 25mph, but they are terrible on the highway. The 25mph is an artificial limit to meet LSV regulations.
All that said, $25k isn't cheap when you can get a basic Polaris SXS for $15k. It might not be street legal in many states, but much of the usage is going to be on private property.
80fj0348i 27 minutes ago
I think a kei truck might be a better choice than a sxs if noise ordinances are a concern. e.g. utility vehicles for groundskeeping staff
alistairSH 14 minutes ago
The utility SXS aren't particuarlly loud; it's the "racing" SXS that have minimal off-road exhausts that are as bad a pipe-less crotch rockets.
DASD 25 minutes ago
I'm in Western North Carolina(Asheville) and there are an actual number of kei trucks here. Not every other vehicle common but enough to see maybe 5-10 every day.
There are even a few businesses that specialize in these vehicles: https://www.marsminitrucks.com
colechristensen 27 minutes ago
In rural Iowa I saw a ton of those little "UTV", gators, or whatever various brands call them which are effectively beefed up golf carts being driven around town. Trucks have become so enormous and expensive that these somewhat street legal vehicles are taking over for people who just need to go here and there.
chao- 27 minutes ago
A friend with a WFH tech job, who lives on his own land (with family and various critters), bought one a few years ago for hauling materials and supplies around his property.
100percentjake 26 minutes ago
Fleets, as evidenced by Toyota/Scion saying they will exclusively sell to fleet purchasers. My local university, for an example, had 20 or so Daihatsu Hijets when I went to school there, which have given way to far more expensive Ford Bronco Sports and similar. I assume the lack of parts supply and repairability of the Hijets attrited them away. Domestically producing them to keep the chicken tax/tariffs at bay and having dealer service at the local Toyota dealership will make these appealing again in those markets.
bryanlarsen 9 minutes ago
LSV's like this are extremely popular in the retirement home communities like The Villages in Florida. They're allowed on the golf cart paths, and also on a few roads where golf carts aren't allowed.
thelittlenag 43 minutes ago
I didn't know Scion had left...
jdc0589 20 minutes ago
bruh
mike_d 25 minutes ago
In 1963 Lyndon Johnson added "light trucks" to the Chicken Tax as a quid pro quo to prevent the auto workers union from striking before the election.
As a result we don't get "right sized" trucks like the kei or more efficient farm vehicles like the hilux.
rootsudo 19 minutes ago
So many people here have never driven a kei truck or a wigo/daihatsu agya.
They are not fun cars, they should be cheap and disposable.
The MSRP for this in japan is less than $10,000,$6000 for the base model:
It's going to go here for what, $15,000? $25,000? Better than buying a 25 yr old one for $10,000 from a used dealer lot that has no parts or real mechanic trained on them but at that price point..
a Mavrick is better.
The amazon truck is better.
SoftTalker 8 minutes ago
$20K (ish) will get you a Slate EV truck with no options, or a forthcoming REO. Those are real, road-legal trucks not carts with a lawn-mower engine.
davexunit 10 minutes ago
The headline excited me but a gas vehicle with a 25mph limit is useless to me. When is someone gonna make an EV truck with a kei-like form factor? The Slate ain't it.
internet2000 11 minutes ago
Let's see if the vocal internet crowd puts their money where their posts are. I predict this being a market failure.
GenerWork 16 minutes ago
Can’t wait for Floridians to jailbreak the ECU and set it the top speed for max 35 MPH in order to treat it like a long bed golf cart.
0xbadcafebee 30 minutes ago
This is pretty cool. It's too bad it's just for fleets. Must be they realized how much money was going to imported Kei trucks, and that they could just... do the importing themselves, and pick up some cash. (edit: looks like they sacrificed payload for the AC/heat? only 600lbs?)
The SXS looks cool, but gearheads want a tiny Jeep replacement (which there are none of in the US), not another UTV/buggy we already have
lenerdenator 42 minutes ago
I like the concept, I just find myself wondering if the Big 3 will pull another Chicken Tax move to protect the full-size pickup golden geese.
Toyota - and Japan in general - has a helluva trade relationship with the US, but that's effectively all Detroit knows how to beat the world at anymore and they love the margins on their truck portfolios, to the point that they considered sedans and most coupes to be too thin to warrant continued production.
tohnjitor 37 minutes ago
Toyota will build this truck in Indiana.
hydrogen7800 37 minutes ago
I recently saw an old kei truck on the road with a CHKNTAX license plate.
moate 35 minutes ago
600 LB weight limit including passengers, top speed of 25 mph, and right hand drive this feels specifically design to be toothless against American pickups. This is a novelty product, I saw an image of one loaded with half a dozen hay bails and I'm wondering who even needs that? This is a novelty car for vineyard owners and show pony stables. Like you'd get just as much use out of a JD Gator and they probably have worse weight distribution.
100percentjake 29 minutes ago
It wasn't "designed" for or against anything American. This is a purely Japanese design designed to Japanese tastes that has historically seen enough success in American markets that Toyota's market research has deemed the juice worth the squeeze to begin manufacturing them in the US to get around the Chicken Tax that previously made them prohibitively expensive and sell them to fleet purchasers. My local university had 20 or so Daihatsu Hijets running around until (I assume) parts supply dried up and they were replaced with far-more-expensive Ford Bronco Sports and similar compact crossovers.
lastofthemojito 28 minutes ago
The nice thing about a minitruck over something like a Gator is you get an interior.
I worked golf course landscaping during some summers in college and drove Gators, which did their job well. But they certainly weren't any relief from being out in the sun all day. This Scion minitruck has heat and air conditioning. And locking doors. So it'll be a respite from the outdoors, as well as a secure (well, as secure as any car) place to leave your personal items.
snovymgodym 24 minutes ago
tl;dr: it's for the neighborhood golf cart market