This development makes me hope that we'd be seeing more of these on common Wi-Fi cards, so that every random laptop could be used as an SDR for many fun and useful applications on a budget.
Turn a WiFi 7 Router into a 320Msps Software Defined Radio Receiver (github.com)
yonatan8070 5 hours ago
dzhiurgis an hour ago
thebeardisred 5 hours ago
alightsoul 2 hours ago
askvictor an hour ago
mikewarot 5 hours ago
I'd add a heat sunk 100 watt DC-5Ghz 20dB fixed attenuator, 0-110 dB switched attenuator, 5 ghz low pass filter, 7-12 Ghz local oscillator/mixer up/down converter, and it would make a small, very high performance service monitor good to 5 Ghz. 8)
octoberfranklin 4 hours ago
mikewarot 3 hours ago
So the signal path in receive mode would be:
N connector / 20 dB 100 watt pad / Switched attenuator / Low pass filter / Front End diodes / Mixer / Router board for DSP
Alternatively, there's usually a second path that skips the attenuator, with a lower maximum power level.
The reverse path would work for generating signals from DC (almost) to 5 Ghz.
Eduard 2 hours ago
mikewarot 2 hours ago
Most of the older, affordable models go from almost DC to 1 Ghz. I've got an IFR 2947a, which goes up to 1.05 Ghz.
Here's an example from ebay.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/168770412399
Here's a specification sheet for the one I have, a pdf
aftbit 6 hours ago
asdff 5 hours ago
ChuckMcM 5 hours ago
"BRINGUP, from a cold radio: what MediaTek's ROM patch does at download (XO, pin mux, the CONN AFE calibration pulse per band, the A-die TOP init by chip ID, pads and CONN switch, the A-dies' eFuse trims); the UMAC pool layout; the common and per-band PHY initialisation; on each A-die the RF init tables, the resistor calibration and the RC filter calibration; the FEM outputs and the crystal trim."
That's not even some other language poorly translated to English, that's just a bunch of words.
Between stuff like this and math "proofs" that aren't readable either I'm really challenged to see the benefit here.
What I get out of this is that one could, if you had the documentation, write a more generalized SDR application for this hardware than the Wifi7 application. That an LLM model can provoke this behavior seems as a good existence proof perhaps?
Aurornis 5 hours ago
The language makes sense if you've worked with radio chips or firmware.
Terms like XO (crystal oscillator) and pin mux (chip pin multiplexer, basically assigning pins to their role) are common for embedded work, not just radio work.
Usually in a project you get that language hidden in a separate implementation doc where casual readers won't get confused by it.
ChuckMcM 5 hours ago
Aurornis 4 hours ago
This project isn't meant to be vendor-quality documentation of the chipset. It's a reverse engineering project that succeeded and included enough documentation to build upon.
Comparing a freely shared reverse engineering proof of concept to vendor-provided 1st party documentation is a ridiculous high bar.
This is a cool project that was just shared hours ago. Criticizing it for not being 1st party vendor documentation quality is a really bad faith criticism.
ChuckMcM 2 hours ago
"Turns a Gemtek W1700K Wi-Fi 7 router into a wideband software-defined receiver. The router's MediaTek MT7996 radio captures raw 14-bit IQ at up to 320 Msps, its Airoha AN7581 SoC streams it over 10 GbE, and a Linux host shows it as a live spectrum and waterfall in the browser, with the receiver's controls next to it."
Does that read paragraph say "Hey check out this PoC!" to you?
So a human, used Claude code to reverse engineer a device. Fine, let THAT be the readme. If it had said, "This is something that was accomplished with Claude code reverse engineering this thing, I have no idea how it works, but that it does work is evidenced by the spectrum I can show."
For those of us who are "skilled in the art" as they say, this reads like "Hey check this out, I bypassed the paywall by putting in my Mom's credit card number!" The lede here is that Claude can reverse engineer things. That was most informatively shown with an article that showed up here titled "All the things I own, owned."
The comment I replied to simply said, "Thanks Claude." Which is droll, but accurate. And, for me, the criticism of showing off something you "did" with a tool you don't understand and whose outputs you don't understand, reminds me strongly of the script kiddies of the 90's and naughts who would boldly proclaim "Hey, check it out, I got root on <website>." when all they had done was run Metasploit and walked through a bunch of scripts until they hit an RCE vulnerability and then used it to gain root (with another script).
So at some point the vendor will go through and patch the holes which the model had exploited and they will have to rewrite their admin architecture, and maybe be liable to some fines with the chip companies if "Intellectual Property" was improperly disclosed by their failure to write good software. And are we any closer to using the products as a general purpose SDR? No, we are not.
Contrast that with the folks who reverse engineered the RealTek DVB-T tuner chip, and had an understanding of what they had done and how it worked, and it spawned a bunch of RTL-SDR dongles that introduced lots of people to SDRs.
It is a really cool project, and it is an interesting proof of concept which could be the starting point for reverse engineering these boxes. But the author chose to present it as a complete ready to go project with documentation of things like their "architecture."
I suspect it is also true that neither the author, and certainly not the large language model, has any idea about how this firmware even works.
bri3d an hour ago
What? It tunes and it's streaming IQ over Ethernet. It is a general purpose SDR! You can use it as a general purpose SDR immediately.
I'd like a little more information from someone who actually knew what they were doing (or even just asked Claude to write it out in more detail) about the "real" nuts and bolts of the receiver, too (how's does IQ imbalance calibration work? How much dynamic range does it really have? How much can we configure the frontend, in detail?), but I don't think it's fair to claim this project is skiddie-level or not useful at this stage just because it was written by Claude.
Also, who's going to fine Mediatek for exposing Mediatek IP?
NitpickLawyer 5 hours ago
> write a more generalized SDR application for this hardware
Yeahhh, no. Sorry but the entry barrier is now extremely lowered, especially in effort.
~20 years ago this would have been literally sci-fi. Back then just getting an USRP to work with gnu-radio, then finding the proper hardware external clock, then doing lots of work on reading / trying stuff / writing scripts etc. took a ton of effort and time. Having the ability to throw tokens at it and have at least a starting point is amazing, IMO.
BlackRabbit1 5 hours ago
We now can programm more manual tuned stuff to turn this into a full 13cm and 5cm radio as it was proven to work.
Before the esp-sdr hack and this one both bands were quite difficult and pricey to reach.
jeffbee 5 hours ago
BlackRabbit1 5 hours ago
This was worth upper 4- to 5-digit of dollars of equipment before.
I work in this industry and sold more than one kidney for this stuff.
Same for the ESP-SDR project. Most likely it can be used for transmitting on S-Band for satellite control in the future (with an amplifier, dish, maybe some filtering). The HF-Frontend is Wi-Fi certified and therefore quite clean. I've forwarded this project to a friend who's close to ESA staff.
jeffbee 5 hours ago
BlackRabbit1 5 hours ago
Yes. That's a very modern design. Lots of MIMO.. so I assume you will find that beast in cellular base stations.
I'd more see it as a huge jump in the higher frequencies.
>2GHz basically became cheap now over night.
Thanks to Claude&co. it now only takes maybe a few hours to find (or brute force ) potential registers to spit out raw I/Q streams. The last huge breakthrough there was the now rather old Rtlsdr project around the Osmocom dudes.
SV_BubbleTime 5 hours ago
OpenAI seething that they didn’t pick a fucking name for their platform.
solyin 3 hours ago
Aurornis 5 hours ago
A year ago it was different. I looked at a lot of these vibe-RE projects and a lot of them wouldn't even do what they claimed. Now if someone points a frontier model at some code and lets it consume tokens for a few days, the output is often valuable as a starting point for other projects.
ctmlr 2 hours ago
radio879 4 hours ago
https://www.rtl-sdr.com/esp32-sdr-turbo-mode-throughput-impr...
mikewarot 3 hours ago
Sideband on 13 CM sounds like an amazing thing to pull off.
acd 5 hours ago
BlackRabbit1 5 hours ago
You cannot sell them with the tag if it wasn't connected to standardized certification test system at least once.
zdw 3 hours ago
That's quite a good deal...
tverbeure 2 hours ago
jedbrooke 5 hours ago
octoberfranklin 4 hours ago
BlackRabbit1 4 hours ago
octoberfranklin 4 hours ago
sigbottle 3 hours ago
dekhn 3 hours ago
BlackRabbit1 3 hours ago
Ham radio operators looking forward using them for 13cm and 5cm band stuff.
bb88 3 hours ago
The RTL SDR is the gateway drug into SDR's. The bandwidth is limited, so don't expect to be capturing HDTV Streams. But it's certainly possible to listen to AM/FM, Ham Bands, VHF/UHF signals, etc.
If you don't want to buy an RTL-SDR, you can search KiwiSDR which is a streaming SDR for frequencies under 30MHz. You can also connect to KiwiSDR's worldwide.
Then if you get the itch, you can go get your a HackRF, a ham license, or whatever else scratches it.
SyzygyRhythm an hour ago
Mostly it's just fun. I like peeking at all the ambient transmissions in the area.
A while back I was more deeply involved in the SDR space and even reverse-engineered some pager signals. At least a few years ago, pagers were still widely used in hospitals (totally in plaintext, by the way).
jeffbee 5 hours ago
yonatan8070 4 hours ago
flemhans 4 hours ago
criddell 3 hours ago
jauntywundrkind 2 hours ago
Not the point but the Airhona could here is really neat. AN7581 with typical quad Cortex-A53 but then 8x RISC-V network coprocessors. Good luck figuring out how to use that though, whew! (Go Astra go.) https://www.airoha.com/products/p/NpfqGLnZiZuYUZ6N
I've been thinking how beautiful and awesome it is that SDR finally has a real jump. The QuadRF using the rpi's mipi connector was such a glorious hack! Custom ADC from parts. 80MSps. https://www.crowdsupply.com/scale-rf/quadrf
And man what a huge flying leap forward here. 320MSps! Much deeper 14b IQ precision vs 8b. The totally custom mediatek radio firmware is incredible. Such incredible possibility. Maybe someday the mimo can be useful for some of the same neat AoE / beam forming capabilities?
yieldcrv 4 hours ago
I’m not seeing a synopsis of the significance of this, for the uninitiated
What is Msps? I’m not familiar with that scale
crest 4 hours ago
tverbeure 4 hours ago
The significance is that most off the shelf SDR platforms have much lower specs. Almost all of them use the same Analog Devices transceiver chip.
BlackRabbit1 4 hours ago
Every WiFi modem has a testmode. It's required to verify the TX/RX chain during manufacturing and for compliance testing.
Seemingly you can read out the entire spectrum at full rate.
crest 4 hours ago