Nitter and XCancel resume service after legal advice (github.com)
codechicago277 16 hours ago
Interesting that they were inspired by Invidious (alternative YouTube frontend). That’s another project that could use some love. Hopefully AI coding tools can do some good and make it easier for these projects to find ways into the walled gardens and work around the counter measures.
Waiting for the day all the social networks allow api access and become usable again. Maybe we can call it “agent first” to help move things along.
lukan 15 hours ago
"Agent First" API access for social networks. What could possibly go wrong.
tempodox 13 hours ago
literalAardvark 6 hours ago
gloosx 15 hours ago
codechicago277 15 hours ago
It’s still the go-to platform for public figures to broadcast unfortunately, so if you want to verify the original comments you need an alternate frontend or an X account.
gloosx 14 hours ago
the currency intervention took place on July 31, during active market hours. It was immediately detected by global trading desks and reported by major news wires like Reuters and Bloomberg as it happened.
When CENTCOM issued the statement regarding the strikes on IRGC targets, the text went live on the official U.S. Central Command Media Portal at the exact same second the automated post hit their X account.
Before anything was posted online, Lightcap sent an official farewell note to the OpenAI team. Once an email is sent to hundreds of tech employees, it was immediately leaked to tech journalists.
It seems, for all three examples, the platform was used merely as a broadcasting service for information that was either already occurring in the public eye or was simultaneously distributed through formal channels.
brigandish 3 hours ago
- needing to look in several places
- looking in one place
Easy to see why Twitter wins, even when information isn't exclusive, which it often is (I would've suggested video involved in news events, which is often impossible to find elsewhere but easily gathered on Twitter).
burnhamup 14 hours ago
Surely a public post on a CHP website would have gotten the job done better.
gloosx 14 hours ago
uhoh-itsmaciek 11 hours ago
gloosx 4 hours ago
yaleman 9 hours ago
progval 14 hours ago
gloosx 14 hours ago
freshpots 13 hours ago
gloosx 13 hours ago
wlonkly 12 hours ago
johannes1234321 10 hours ago
Of course such information should be on the operator's website as primary source ...
antif 9 hours ago
They changed terms against their captive users and forced policy changes to end open publishing and firehose APIs—which the organization had once championed and enshrined.
koyote 11 hours ago
I personally do not know anyone in real life with a twitter account (although I have one, I have not used it in over 15 years), I wonder how many people just go without this information and are angry that it's (seemingly) not available.
parineum 9 hours ago
marcosdumay 9 hours ago
That said, RSS seems way simpler.
parineum 8 hours ago
RSS aggregation seems like the solution to me but I think we've got to admit defeat on that one because it's been around forever and people don't use it.
cxr 7 hours ago
numpad0 8 hours ago
prmoustache 6 hours ago
quadrifoliate 8 hours ago
Won't happen in the US/UK because the governments are in Elon's pockets. Won't happen in the EU because they are incapable of getting anything done.
So unless you're in a jurisdiction other than the above three I wouldn't hold your breath about any laws being passed about this.
bentcorner 8 hours ago
misstuned 3 hours ago
A lot of private companies do the same thing - no way to effectively contact them privately, but as soon as you whinge publicly on X they're "on it". Octopus Energy is one of the worst for that.
numpad0 8 hours ago
koyote 6 hours ago
Simply embed the 'update' feed on a page in the existing website and have some kind of admin panel where employees can easily CRUD some updates.
I guess because even this would not be 'free', twitter ends up winning.
progval 4 hours ago
croon an hour ago
In my experience this is usually the crux. That software always rots, and needs whatever (minimal) on-ramping for employees, as well as access management.
If I could wave a wand at those solutions I'd stop fighting the user and let them post to Twitter or wherever, and just have a public facing page pull those posts as updates for consumers outside of whatever walled garden they originate from.
charcircuit 5 hours ago
me-vs-cat 2 hours ago
smcin 8 hours ago
trhaynes 8 hours ago
smcin 7 hours ago
Implicated 7 hours ago
smcin 6 hours ago
Can any other user of public transport in Paris comment?
philipallstar an hour ago
1. the service may not be - every small provider has downtime, perhaps proportionally to their size.
2. the tools to update Twitter are well understood, and you can get software that does scheduling of posts across multiple platforms, previews of what posts will look like, etc etc, and said preview works well on the many platforms that people are already using. People doing the updating may prefer to use those tools over what the internal tool gives them.
progval 4 hours ago
Oxodao 2 hours ago
PennRobotics an hour ago
Macha 14 hours ago
gloosx 14 hours ago
sjourner 13 hours ago
mosura 13 hours ago
mitxela 11 hours ago
debugnik 12 hours ago
Animats 7 hours ago
There are MTA data feeds, in General Transit Feed Specification format, for program use. Those are for systems that update maps.
The MTA dumped Twitter/X in 2023 because Twitter/X wanted to charge them for using their API, and the MTA refused. [1] The MTA also said that Twitter/X had too much downtime.
When the MTA first got into social media, the person who took the job demanded a desk in the rail control center, so she could see all the displays and immediately hear about problems. If someone mentioned a problem on Twitter, she'd reply immediately. That was the right idea. Few organizations have the guts to put the control room on social media.
[1] https://www.mta.info/press-release/statement-mta-acting-chie...
tokioyoyo 11 hours ago
There’s a system that is not replicable unless you have majority of the population on the same social media.
qingcharles 6 hours ago
byoogle 5 hours ago
antman 5 hours ago
byoogle 5 hours ago
sigmoid10 an hour ago
Can you share how you prevent spammers from simply using this to do what they usually do, or, if not, how you will stop Cloudflare et al. from marking your browsers as bots and hammering them with captchas? Easy access to the plain web for bots is a pretty tough cat and mouse game and I have been playing it with very short term success at best myself.
quaintdev 15 hours ago
phoghed 15 hours ago
dvt 15 hours ago
phoghed 13 hours ago
mitxela 10 hours ago
vrganj 15 hours ago
Move people over slowly as you add new features the old platform doesn't porvide.
phyzix5761 15 hours ago
vrganj 15 hours ago
nixosbestos 15 hours ago
But of course, even among HNers, there's amazing cognitive dissonance among "decentralization is hard and takes effort" and "omg, of course the next centralized platform won't be bought by an insecure dictator-wannabe".
I'm not that old, it's played out over and over. I shouldn't even comment here. Decentralization or bust.
exceptione 15 hours ago
OroPla 14 hours ago
People have also been conditioned to mostly trust whatever is on Wikipedia despite years of efforts to hammer it into people that this is not an okay assumption.
It would be better for there to be a bunch of Wikis that are competing with each other evenly. Having only Wikipedia is not a healthy thing.
rsynnott 12 hours ago
... I mean, there _are_ (Conservapedia, Ruwiki, Metapedia, etc). It's just that the non-wikipedia generalist ones are so poorly run that no sensible person would ever use them, and usually have a fairly extreme ideological bent (there's a spectrum; Metapedia originally showed up because Conservapedia was insufficiently delusional for some peoples' liking) which requires them to wholesale make shit up (as the old joke goes, reality has a liberal bias). However, if Wikipedia ever goes all evil, I would assume it'll just be forked (there've been a number of prior forks, but except for Ruwiki they've generally died due to lack of interest).
There are, honestly, serious economies of scale here. Unless Wikipedia actually has gone evil, well, no-one actually wants to maintain 66 million articles (No-one, say, wants to maintain 14,000 articles about bridges: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Bridges_...). Specialist wikis work, but it'll take something fairly dramatic to break Wikipedia's dominance.
(In an ideal world, I think this _would_ be more decentralised, but it's just very difficult for that to happen in practice. I think much more difficult than social media, which has never really _fully_ centralised in the first place.)
OroPla 37 minutes ago
Unfortunately Wikipedia exists within a collective blind spot, so I am not expecting the situation to change. At most people will drop Wikipedia in favor of LLMs, which is even worse.
karmakurtisaani 15 hours ago
citric7 14 hours ago
avadodin 2 hours ago
Mass social networks are influencer territory.
You do want the reach —otherwise you'd just make a group on Session with your friends or whatever.
The centralized platforms are a dictatorship of sorts but they make the often insufficient effort to include groups that hate each other.
If a Mastodon instance can become that centralized platform, I'll be the first to sign up.
vladms 14 hours ago
add-sub-mul-div 15 hours ago
ranger_danger 15 hours ago
And in the context of twitter-style platforms, federation to me has always seemed like a "which wind would you like to piss into?" situation where you have no idea what servers/people can even see what you're posting, especially when many (even large) servers not only share centralized error-prone block/ban lists but also keep defederating from each other.
buboh 15 hours ago
wrxd 14 hours ago
ranger_danger 14 hours ago
shevy-java 15 hours ago
The billionaires make using their products quite simple. It was easy to sign up for twitter back when it was still usable. Even before Elon took over, it basically died.
tolerance 15 hours ago
Whatever politics or technologies that make alternative platforms "better" to some people doesn't matter to most. The idea that new platforms should even have the "millions" (read: the masses) in mind comes across as being antithetical to the trend toward decentralized tech.
pmlnr 14 hours ago
This is some sort of absolute, fundamental difference between the early web and now, at least how I experienced it as a teen in the late 90s in Hungary. Back then I made a site, because you wanted to make something of my own, in my style, as I wanted. There was nobody else online from my friends, and I made new friends online. I actually found my age people on ICQ, within the same subculture.
This "oh my friends are there" approach is what destroys everything. More precisely the people who can't decide for themselves.
tolerance 13 hours ago
trompetenaccoun 2 hours ago
The old web was a very different place, it wasn't as centralized and there were significantly fewer people around. There were specific forums that you'd go to for specific topics. Say you were interested in West African dances - there was usually the one forum where all the West African dance nerds hung out. At most a couple of different ones. And they were very small communities. If there were issues with the admins or moderation users could and did do mass walk-outs and create a new place.
Melatonic 3 hours ago
codedokode 10 hours ago
tolerance 9 hours ago
Think about why they should care about your answer and if there's any proof that it bothers them to the degree that they may view your alternative platforms as actual solutions.
mtrimpe 15 hours ago
jcgl 15 hours ago
fatal94 15 hours ago
coalstartprob4 13 hours ago
most people in bluesky moved to bluesky driven by hate and fear instead of love and curiosity
i notice they talk bad a lot about other people's posts in other platforms
drannex 10 hours ago
weiran 5 hours ago
krige 3 hours ago
deadbabe 15 hours ago
grebc 13 hours ago
mitxela 10 hours ago
If you're engaging in discussions you need the network. If you're reading municipal weather warnings you don't really, it's just a data source that can be copied anywhere.
Melatonic 3 hours ago
moolcool 15 hours ago
import 14 hours ago
mikepurvis 14 hours ago
echelon 14 hours ago
The internet we had in the 90's and early 00's was amazing. Everything felt free, indie, hackable, composable, ingestible. You didn't worry about platforms because most platforms exposed their data via friendly APIs (remember when Reddit and Twitter had an API and that they encouraged people to actually use them?)
RSS everywhere, websites with honest to god Bittorrent links. Software you could download and own without a subscription. Forums, Geocities, personal websites, IRC (no Discord ads, server caps, rules against scripting), RPG Maker 2000.
Google and Facebook and Twitter fucked us. The 2010's - 2020's were cellphone incrementalism and walled garden overgrowth.
Hell, even Flash was awesome pre-Adobe. It was buggy, full of zero day vulns, and was inefficient for mobile, but children as young as 8 could build games and animations -- and they were! We got left with a pile of "standards" CSS, Javascript transpilers, competing standards, nodegrunts, and library churn and it was never the same.
Thankfully, I'm starting to feel that AI models are going to let us tear down the walls. We can easily spin up indie experiments again in our spare hours after work and do a lot of neat stuff. It feels like the late 90's / early 00's again.
I think the biggest mistake Google made was developing AI, which seem to be the seeds of big tech's undoing. We can totally overrun them now.
AI = actually a threat to big tech, not a moat. They're going to kill themselves with their own product.
We'll probably build distributed protocols that can finally get the product and UX love that compel people to start using them.
And it feels so awesome to just build things I love - games on the weekend, custom audio players, file organizers, SRS software. I'm loving software again for the first time in a long time. Robotics...
pampas 13 hours ago
mosura 13 hours ago
echelon 13 hours ago
1. Google de-ossifies and starts shipping. They have all the AI talent and infra necessary to "own" AI and get people and industry using its models and products. They don't have the same costs that OpenAI and Anthropic do and have a much healthier income stream. They can productively put Gemini in front of more people and embed deep into people's lives. Google leapfrogs Apple, Amazon, Meta, and its other peers because of its incumbent advantages in AI, data, and distribution.
2. Google bleeds out all Google Search ad revenue. People switch away from Chrome to browser agents that have adblock and remove ads. Gemini languishes. Once unassailable Android comes under attack from vibe coded upstarts that no longer require a trillion dollars to compete. Google still sells a lot of enterprise B2B infra (cloud, workspace) and YouTube continues to thrive. Everything else about Google becomes IBM while YouTube becomes Comcast. Still a giant, but a shell of its former self.
I'm sure there are other possible futures as well, but these are the two I see for Google.
I keep oscillating between predictions #1 and #2. Right now I'm feeling #2.
kevin_thibedeau 11 hours ago
abtinf 5 hours ago
mitxela 11 hours ago
alex1138 8 hours ago
mitxela 8 hours ago
brigandish 3 hours ago
bsoqk 11 hours ago
codechicago277 9 hours ago
AstralSerenity 6 hours ago
I have an old Wyze Scale that restricts advanced features behind a proprietary mega-app, forcing users to swipe past their other services. I've now been able to reverse engineer their Bluetooth protocol which can be used with tools like OpenScale.
In an older world, this would have been a prolonged endeavor for juice that ultimately isn't worth the squeeze. Now it can now takes place in an afternoon.
protocolture 5 hours ago
And then remove all copyright law and patents pertaining to software. So the subsequent players are forced to play nice with everyone.
kitd 3 hours ago
I'd say advertising has fucked up the Internet. Everything they (and plenty of others) have done has been to collect and sell personal data to advertising brokers.
phatskat 2 hours ago
GJim an hour ago
Nothing wrong with honest advertising per se..... back in the day we bought computer magazines mainly for the adverts.
Rather, the problem is the SV AdTech industry which seeks to track me, invade my privacy at every opportunity and is busy sniffing my knickers trying to work out if I'm pregnant so they can sell me more shite.
One observes the FUD those employed by AdTEch are spreading on here about the GDPR; a bunch of people whose very salaries are dependent on abusing our privacy.
cnr 14 hours ago
gspr 14 hours ago
Less radically, we can demand that any entity that takes any public money (and of course public entities themselves) avoid communicating solely through closed platforms.
It's insane that the primary public communication channel for e.g. certain UK government institutions and the Norwegian police, was Twitter at one point!
specproc 13 hours ago
We need open APIs, transparent algorithms, and above all, accountability.
rsynnott 12 hours ago
NelsonMinar 13 hours ago
In the early days of social media it was a standard that you could get your lists of friends, etc out and then use them to bootstrap your social network on new social media. All the big players like Twitter and Facebook took advantage of that and then locked down their own platforms to make it hard for you to move your social network out of them.
mitxela 10 hours ago
Perhaps part of the reason we don't do that any more is that signup is so high friction? It used to be just username, password, confirm password, captcha, submit. But now it's username, password, confirm password, email, phone number, captcha, submit, go to phone, open email app, wait for slow loading, refresh, wait for slow refresh, click email, see long link, click link, "this must be opened on the device you signed up with", back, retype 100 random characters on the computer with perfect accuracy, "email verified", next step, go to phone, open SMS app, wait for slow loading, no new SMS, back to computer, "send code again (wait 60 seconds)", wait 60 seconds, click it, go to phone, finally get a 6-digit code, back to computer, type it in, submit.
Signing up for things is a massive chore now. Because they want so much personal identification data, that they don't actually need for the function because they never send an email or an SMS.
And if you're signing up on the same device you're checking your email and SMS on, it's straight up impossible because every time you switch to the email app, it unloads the browser app and forgets its state so the verification is invalid. You have to keep trying 6-7 times and hope maybe one time you'll do it quick enough that the browser will stay resident in memory.
I actually have at least two phone apps that are social-adjacent that do signup secretly in the background. You just install the app, and it generates a random identifier and uses that as your account ID. Nothing is visible to the user. In the settings is an import/export option for device migration. If you want signups, this is how to get them.
AlienRobot 10 hours ago
The problem with all the decentralized alternatives is that they sacrifice usability for decentralization and then almost nobody cares about decentralization so for most people it's only downsides.
viccis 10 hours ago
tripleee 9 hours ago
the "better" that will win will be what's more engaging and addictive
TiredOfLife 9 hours ago
grishka 9 hours ago
crossroadsguy 7 hours ago
Barrin92 6 hours ago
it's been solved, ban the platform. This is a collective action problem. Even if every single user on platform X wants to move to platform Y, as long as they can't coordinate the movement individual cost exceeds the benefit they'd all get.
So the most straight forward way is to get rid of the platform , and everyone will move out of necessity.
iamflimflam1 16 hours ago
His response was - they've got a team of lawyers on payroll whose job it is to make you run out of money...
1asf21 16 hours ago
The entire business model of the AI industry, who resell and launder the scraped data, would collapse.
Nitter just makes it visible to a human and has anti-scraper measures necessitated by the thieves like xAI.
Additionally, a GoFundMe would reach astronomical proportions given how unpopular Musk is.
kova12 16 hours ago
terribleperson 15 hours ago
psolidgold 15 hours ago
alansaber 15 hours ago
bix6 13 hours ago
alansaber an hour ago
misstuned 3 hours ago
alansaber 44 minutes ago
LatticeAnimal 15 hours ago
stymaar 15 hours ago
mmooss 11 hours ago
stymaar 6 hours ago
Second: the US justice system is also a joke. I could fight Google in justice and win in my country (France) and in pretty much any other developed country because a working system doesn't let big actor DoS smaller player out of justice. You obviously can't fix a corrupt syatem with technology.
joquarky 7 hours ago
throw0101a 13 hours ago
This may be a plot point in a William Gibson novel.
wraptile 5 hours ago
ValentineC 15 hours ago
Someone's name needs to be at the bottom of the paperwork, and those court filing costs would also add up.
worldsavior 15 hours ago
sourcecodeplz 2 hours ago
warrantisall 15 hours ago
embedding-shape 14 hours ago
ocd 16 hours ago
add-sub-mul-div 16 hours ago
timmmmmmay 15 hours ago
paulryanrogers 9 hours ago
skeledrew 16 hours ago
rsynnott 12 hours ago
ViktorRay 9 hours ago
dieselgate 9 hours ago
willmeyers 16 hours ago
rfgplk 16 hours ago
opello 16 hours ago
15155 16 hours ago
Regardless of advice quality, legal proceedings aren't free-to-play, and the adversary in question here has bottomless pockets.
loa_in_ 16 hours ago
15155 14 hours ago
The best legal professionals, just like the best software engineers, have wholly embraced LLM assistance.
"Gee, we bill $700/hr but just can't figure out how to put a prompt into a chat interface." Please.
gamblor956 6 hours ago
LLMs have been making so many mistakes that the big firms have slowed or even paused their LLM spend. And that was before CA passed a law relating legal AI use.
Terr_ 7 hours ago
FFS, we're already at the edge of having to pay to know what the laws even are. [0]
[0] https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2022/03/pro-codes-act-wolf-she...
tyjen 15 hours ago
ValentineC 15 hours ago
dgrin91 14 hours ago
Cider9986 14 hours ago
https://annas-archive.gd for reference.
mitxela 10 hours ago
usern20260720 16 hours ago
graemep 16 hours ago
slater 15 hours ago
Then they stopped it, because "eNgaGeMEnT" or w/e
numpad0 15 hours ago
mnadkvlb 15 hours ago
muppetman 14 hours ago
wafflemaker 14 hours ago
Maybe selfhost on an old phone? Just guessing what the OP meant.
muppetman 14 hours ago
usern20260720 40 minutes ago
himata4113 15 hours ago
Retro_Dev 15 hours ago
jesuslop 11 hours ago
elcritch 14 hours ago
The code looks surprisingly easy to hack on: https://github.com/zedeus/nitter/blob/master/src/nitter.nim
Polizeiposaune 14 hours ago
"The long-term plan is to rewrite the source code in Go, as I'm no longer interested in using Nim. This isn't a small task, but building more features with the current state of things is painful. Before doing that I'll fix some feature parity issues, and work on some conveniences for instance operators. Stay tuned."
dom96 12 hours ago
MrDrMcCoy 6 hours ago
mathverse 42 minutes ago
It's a research project of its BDFL and he is alienating the most senior developers and contributors to Nim's ecosystems (ie Zedeus).
elcritch 8 hours ago
Nitter uses Jester which seems dead for sure, but doing static binaries is easy. Personally I just forked Mummy to continue as MummyNG since I prefer threaded servers so things like JSON parsing doesn’t cause latency issues.
Though that being written over a year ago it’s either not a high priority or harder than it seems. I’ll be curious to see which. LLMs make it easier than ever for others to contribute or to fix up deps.
gblargg 7 hours ago
Door 2: improve x.com to be better than third-party sites.
Which is, Elon?
hyperionultra 7 hours ago
archon810 7 hours ago
davkan 5 hours ago
boelboel 2 hours ago
userbinator an hour ago
I suspect the original C&Ds were just their legal team wanting to "do something" upon hearing about Nitter somehow, and not Elon personally commanding them.
...and I noticed that X did bring back a (quite) limited JS-free "lite version" recently, so maybe they are changing for the better.
numpad0 16 hours ago
mitxela 10 hours ago
numpad0 8 hours ago
HDBaseT 4 hours ago
Marsymars 5 hours ago
int32_64 16 hours ago
delichon 16 hours ago
The word "project" doesn't make a clear distinction between the repo and the instances. Nitter is on good ground with respect to the repo. The instances will be much harder to defend. From that one sentence it isn't clear if this is what the legal advice says or not.
Nitter changed their design such that it now requires an X account to scrape through. This was to stay functional after X removed guest accounts. This exposes them to a legal attack through the terms of service that must be accepted for the account, and to technical attack by blocking the scraping accounts.
miningtcup 16 hours ago
delichon 15 hours ago
https://theintercept.com/2022/12/15/elon-musk-leaks-twitter/
Nitter might want to make sure that their scrapes are bit-identical to other accounts to defeat this.
kay_o 8 hours ago
mudkipdev 14 hours ago
kertoip_1 13 hours ago
gblargg 7 hours ago
Retro_Dev 16 hours ago
zImPatrick 14 hours ago
Cider9986 12 hours ago
Retro_Dev 12 hours ago
Cider9986 9 hours ago
tim-- 7 hours ago
m101 11 hours ago
petcat 16 hours ago
Those people should seek their own legal advice.
miningtcup 16 hours ago
toomuchtodo 16 hours ago
miningtcup 16 hours ago
toomuchtodo 16 hours ago
Put a tip jar out, let’s get archiving. “You can just do things.”
bhhaskin 16 hours ago
miningtcup 16 hours ago
Tostino 15 hours ago
andOlga 13 hours ago
pessimizer 13 hours ago
mitxela 10 hours ago
petcat 16 hours ago
mitxela 10 hours ago
Decabytes 14 hours ago
MikhailTal 14 hours ago
No this is the hard problem. HN people live in a bubble. Anything else than signup with oauth and then having access to everyone and its too hard and 99% of people will click away.
SoftTalker 7 hours ago
leumon 16 hours ago
m00dy an hour ago
throw03172019 7 hours ago
sparkling 16 hours ago
cdrnsf 15 hours ago
KennyBlanken 14 hours ago
It's getting to the point where his private security are harassing people for walking down the street in their own neighborhood that runs alongside one of his "compounds."
mitxela 10 hours ago
1matin 16 hours ago
It's actually sad to see how deeply do we depend on monopolies.
ranger_danger 15 hours ago
Other solutions might not have the exact same functionality, but in this context of mere availability... it really doesn't matter.